Dropping out after receiving the award

[Devils_Advocate]

I'm curious about something: I know that if you drop out of the SMART program, you have to pay back any money you've received as a low interest student loan. But does that mean you can drop out over the summer before you receive any funding with no financial penalties?

I ask because I have two potential research advisers, but the one that I really want to work for is not cool with the mandatory summers away at a facility (it makes me want to reply, "Then you should offer me more money, a$$hole"). If I decide to go with him, can I back out?

[WestToEast]

Everything I've read on here, says that you can drop out all the way up until you sign the contract at Orientation.

[Devils_Advocate]

And that's in mid-July?

[Guest]

I'm curious about something: I know that if you drop out of the SMART program, you have to pay back any money you've received as a low interest student loan. But does that mean you can drop out over the summer before you receive any funding with no financial penalties?

I ask because I have two potential research advisers, but the one that I really want to work for is not cool with the mandatory summers away at a facility (it makes me want to reply, "Then you should offer me more money, a$$hole"). If I decide to go with him, can I back out?

I think you should seriously reconsider working for someone who wouldn't let you accept this scholarship.

[SMART recipient]

The official statement is you can drop out until orientation, but I think they will let you have as long as you have not received your first month's award. You officially belong to the "payback" contract after you get your first month's check or they pay your tuition. SMART also has been changing a lot of policy and procedures lately, so I'd go with whatever they tell you in orientation or literature before that.

Even with all the craziness going on with SMART's restructuring, it is still regarded as a program with high potential and esteem in the academic community, so I don't understand why your advisor wouldn't want you to take it. But to each their own.

[Guest 2012a]

The official statement is you can drop out until orientation, but I think they will let you have as long as you have not received your first month's award. You officially belong to the "payback" contract after you get your first month's check or they pay your tuition. SMART also has been changing a lot of policy and procedures lately, so I'd go with whatever they tell you in orientation or literature before that.

Even with all the craziness going on with SMART's restructuring, it is still regarded as a program with high potential and esteem in the academic community, so I don't understand why your advisor wouldn't want you to take it. But to each their own.

Because 25% of the year will be spent doing research for someone else. I don't think it is unreasonable for the advisor to feel that way. With that said, if you (OP) have an advisor who does support the acceptance of the SMART Scholarship, that very well may be a deciding factor for you. Without knowing your financial status, the program to which you have been accepted (and therefore whether you will be paid by TA, RA, not at all, etc.) and whether your tuition will be covered by you or the program in which you are involved, this could potentially be a huge advantage. Working with the advisor you really want may not be worth everything you may lose in not accepting the award.

Weigh the pros and cons of each, but yes, you do have plenty of time to make your final decision. You can always work for your second choice advisor and propose doing a project more along the lines of what you may do with your first choice advisor, since you will not require funding from his research grants as an RA as you will be bringing your own funding. Good luck with your decision.

[Guest]

In my own student-advisor relationship, I have found the SMART scholarship to be of great help. My advisor appreciates the fact that he no longer has to pay my stipend and tuition. It has made it possible for me to drive my own research and not have to get projects funded or work on a funded project that doesn't relate directly to my dissertation.

-2009 SMART Scholar

[Devils_Advocate]

In my own student-advisor relationship, I have found the SMART scholarship to be of great help. My advisor appreciates the fact that he no longer has to pay my stipend and tuition. It has made it possible for me to drive my own research and not have to get projects funded or work on a funded project that doesn't relate directly to my dissertation.

-2009 SMART Scholar

I totally agree! Especially when the pay difference between the two is $5k - $6k as well! I think the lack of flexibility it attending conferences and doing work for him over the summer is his complaint, but I'm having trouble seeing his side of the issue.

I'll keep this in mind as I decide what to do. He's a solid guy to work for, but may not be worth it.

[Guest]

In my own student-advisor relationship, I have found the SMART scholarship to be of great help. My advisor appreciates the fact that he no longer has to pay my stipend and tuition. It has made it possible for me to drive my own research and not have to get projects funded or work on a funded project that doesn't relate directly to my dissertation.

-2009 SMART Scholar

I totally agree! Especially when the pay difference between the two is $5k - $6k as well! I think the lack of flexibility it attending conferences and doing work for him over the summer is his complaint, but I'm having trouble seeing his side of the issue.

I'll keep this in mind as I decide what to do. He's a solid guy to work for, but may not be worth it.

Only $5-6k difference!? Where do you go to school that they pay you over $30k as a student????

There is also no reason you can't go to conferences. I go to them all the time. Also, there's no reason you can't still do dissertation research over the summer in addition to your internship as long as 100% of your research isn't in a lab. Usually you have to do at least some analytical work or data reduction/interpretation and lots of writing. Besides that, if the advisor doesn't pay you, you don't work for him anyway. You are independently funded and that means they can get you to work on their pet project ideas they can't afford to get funded if they have to pay a student. By the time a professor pays a students tuition, fees, and wages over a 2 or 3 year proposal, and then the school burdens that money by 50%, your professor can save upwards of 50k per year of proposal at a public university...more if you are out of state or at a private school. Sometimes that's enough of a money savings that they can get some project idea funded they wouldn't normally be able to. A GOOD advisor would be much more concerned about how a significant period of DoD employment would affect your future prospects of going into academia. You are not likely to publish near as much at a DoD lab, if at all, as compared to a traditional post-doc. So, you do that for enough years and you become a pariah in the academic world with all of them wondering why you are too lazy to publish for 3 or 4 years. Show the guy how much money he would save by not having to fund you beyond project materials, printing, and a computer and tell him you can still go to conferences and do analytical studies and writing at night and over the weekends during the internship and if he still doesn't go for it, either he doesn't like the prospect of losing a grad to a non-academic career or he's a moron.

[Guest]

Show the guy how much money he would save by not having to fund you beyond project materials, printing, and a computer and tell him you can still go to conferences and do analytical studies and writing at night and over the weekends during the internship and if he still doesn't go for it, either he doesn't like the prospect of losing a grad to a non-academic career or he's a moron.

Recent PhD SMART grad here, and I concur with Guest. The professor is usually not thinking about this carefully.

I had an advisor who HATED when his students would take summers off. He wasn't too happy about me going away for the summers either, but the fact that I was free labor to him was super beneficial. After 1 year in the SMART program his follow-up funding proposal was rejected, and he was especially grateful to have a student he wasn't responsible to pay for helping him get through it.

However, another main reason why some PhD advisers do not like this scholarship is that it places a VERY large burden on them to help the student finish on time. If the adviser and student are both driven, it can be accomplished, but no one knows how research is going to go 4 years from graduation. To make them commit to a timeline within a semester of when the student will complete is a very difficult task, and one that many advisers don't like to be held to.