salary once you finish

[recipient21]

and if you are offered some of those perks, GET IT IN WRITING from your SF Human Resources specialist (NOT your mentor) BEFORE you sign the SMART agreement

[fish_]

using usajobs, i saw that the sf was hiring entry-level compsci and math BS grads at $60k/year. since the jobs were "open" for only a week, it appeared that they were hiring from within, hopefully bringing their interns into permanent positions.

[Guest]

Thanks a lot for the info, this pretty much confirmed my suspicions , it is kind of disappointing considering I have an internship this summer with a private company that pays relatively the same as this. It's tough to decide it only seems like a pay cut to me. I am a finalist waiting notification on whether I won or not. I've been fighting with whether It is a good idea or not. Also it worries me because there are a lot of negative stories about experiences in the smart program , I hardly found anyone content with their situation so job satisfaction unfortunately seems to be an issue as well.

[recipient21]

using usajobs, i saw that the sf was hiring entry-level compsci and math BS grads at $60k/year. since the jobs were "open" for only a week, it appeared that they were hiring from within, hopefully bringing their interns into permanent positions.

You're probably right in your assumption.

But even if you were to throw your hat in the ring on the posting, if the posting was for a GS-12/13 and you were fresh out of school with a PhD, or the posting was for a GS-9 and you were fresh out of school with a BS, the facility's HR dept would disqualify you because you didn't have "time in grade". The HR specialists within DoD seem to be literally unable to give you a higher grade than what OPM says they can give you. Makes you wonder why we're even paying them to do that kind of stuff if it can simply be written as a logical if-then-else statement where your credentials are tested against the OPM standards...

[fish_]

@recipient21: you have to look at the each announcement. some are for entry level, meaning that education is substitued for experience. most are for promotions from one level to another, with the requirement to have one year experience at the previous level.

[recipient21]

@recipient21: you have to look at the each announcement. some are for entry level, meaning that education is substitued for experience. most are for promotions from one level to another, with the requirement to have one year experience at the previous level.

I think you might be mistaken. A lot of mentors or other base personnel might say that education substitutes for experience, but if you get into an HR specialist's office, you're going to be told a different story. OPM does not allow the HR person to substitute education for "time in grade" (the one year you're talking about), which is the ultimate requirement for progression in the GS system. Just because it says "entry level" does not mean you can skip a grade.

If you were looking at a pay banding scale, that's a different animal and I haven't researched that one as much as I have the GS system.

[fish_]

@recipient21: i agree that "OPM does not allow the HR person to substitute education for "time in grade"", that requirement, if allowed, will be spelled out in the job announcement.

this particular job announceent covers a range of occupations and the pay scale for each based on experience
http://www.usajobs.gov/GetJob/ViewDetails/300954800
if you look at the OPM requierments for any of these jobs, the lowest grade will be for someone with education only, no experience

[Salary when Hired]

For those Interested, here is the grade and step I start at when I start working in mid-Summer for CERDEC at the Aberdeen Proving Grounds in Maryland.

School: Georgia Institute of Technology
Degree/Major: M.S. Mechanical Engineering
GPA: 3.8/4.00 (at time of salary being offered)
Work Experience: 11 months of engineering internships (3 internships during undergrad, 1 internship for Sponsoring Facility)

Based on Special Rate Tables for engineers, (they use this for engineers instead of standard GS Scales)

http://apps.opm.gov/SpecialRates/2012/T ... 12012.aspx

I will start at a GS-9, Step 4, or $58,183. HR Stated that they do look at your GPA and your work experience to determine which step you start at. For a Masters you start at a Grade 9, Step 1 and adjust from there. Apparently I would have started at GS-9 Step 6 if I had 12 months of work experience but this does me little help now (and they stated they can not give you Step 5 instead for being just short of 12 months).

For those with internships still to go it might be worthwhile to manage the number of weeks/months you work if you are nearing a point such as 12 months of work experience. I do not know what qualifications specifically brought me from Step 1 to Step 4 but they state GPA and work experience. I also do not know what points they look at for work experience (i.e. potentially they offer a step increase if you have at least 6 months of experience, etc.)

It doesn't look like research and publications really factor in to your salary.

There is very little room for negotiation. For my division, they have strict standards as to what pay level you start at based on some sort of chart that they have.

Hope this helps others for those interested in the program and for those choosing the lengths of their internships to hit round work-experience length numbers.

[Retirement]

As a sidenote, the salary might be lower in the beginning when compared to private workers but make sure to look into the benefits category. After 5 years of work you are entitled to a retirement pension equal to 5% of the average of your 3 highest salaries. If your highest salaries were averaged around $75,000, at 5% you would get $3750 a year, inflation-indexed, until you die.

This percentage keeps on getting larger and larger the longer you work. It looks like if you were to work for the government for 40 years, (from ages 22 to 62), you could have a retirement pension of 44% of your highest 3 year average of salaries. If highest salary was $100,000 (for round numbers) your pension would be $44,000 a year, inflation-indexed.

This is a tremendous amount of cash when you consider this along with social security and the TSP (government 401k equivalent). As long as the system holds up for the U.S. Government these benefits can potentially dwarf the private industry for occupations held constant.

Just something to think about when joining the Federal Government...

[AlmostRight]

After 5 years of work you are entitled to a retirement pension equal to 5% of the average of your 3 highest salaries. If your highest salaries were averaged around $75,000, at 5% you would get $3750 a year, inflation-indexed, until you die.

Almost, a recent bill just passed (not sure if signed into law yet) has changed this for all new hires after 31 Dec 12 and all feds with less than 5 years job experience. The new provisions for our retirement is a high-5 calculation and we will be paying 3.2%, as opposed to the current .8%, to our pensions every pay day. Still its not a bad retirement plan, thats subject to change at almost any time.